black lake is not the bass fishery it used to be

[PATWIGS]

Maybe decreasing the daily limit to 2 bass would solve the problem. That way, the meat men can still have a few filets in the pan and the rest of us who practice catch and release will have a few more fish to play with. The property owners might encourage their guests to practice a "selective harvest" while staying at their establishments in order to preserve the wonderful fishery that so many of us enjoy.

[ken18621]

First let me say that I have not intentionally kept or killed a bass for consumption in years.

My family and myself recently returned from our first trip to BL and, in my opinion, it is a wonderful fishery.

I find it funny that a lot of folks seem to be pointing fingers at everyone else about the lack of quality bass in BL, and not one person has stepped up and said that they can do something themselves to help the problem.


Think of how many fishermen are on the lake at any given time. If it is like these forums appear to be, there will be 99% catch and release fishermen ( we will talk about the guys that keep bass to eat later).

I think that 100 boats on the lake per day is very conservative. Lets say that each boat lands 25 bass per day (our average while there). That makes 2,500 bass that are pulled out of the water each and every day. (17,500 bass per week)


I see a lot of talk on here about folks using Senkos. I use them myself. In my experience, bass will eat the senko and about half the time the hook will be down its throat. Now, after putting up the hard battle that bass do, what kind of damage might come from having a hook embedded in their throat? Sure they seem fine when we put them back in the water, but we only see them for a split second.,,,,,, I am curious what is the mortality rate from this is.

I usually used a 2/0 weedless hook to fish a senko. it was quite common to have a bass hooked deep in the throat. I was always concerned of the damage it caused while trying to extract the hook from that deep in the bass. A lot of times I would cut the line,shank and weed guard off the hook and release the bass hoping it was a better alternative than trying to get the hook out. While at BL I was introduced to the circle wacky hooks (size 1) and I found it much easier to extract the hook (thank you Capt. Randy).

Also, I am curious how many c & r fishermen eliminate the barbs from their hooks, making for an easier extraction and causing less damage to the fish.


Now on to the meat eaters. Going back to my catch and release mortality theory, how many 12-15" bass do they have to cull through to get a limit of keepers? I think a slot limit could improve the numbers of quality bass and satisfy the guys that want some for dinner. The meat eaters can keep a limit of 12-15" bass with 1 over 18".

My response to "tearing down all the fish cleaning houses"..........I look at it this way....... For arguements sake, If it was the guys keeping bass to eat are the main factor for the lack of big bass in the lake and all the cottage owners tore down thier fish cleaning houses and demanded everyone to catch and release bass. Think of the economic impact it would have on the cottage owners, continuing a trickle down effect to the tackle shops,gas stations, and other businesses. Without the cottages on the lake a great number of us would not have a place to stay.
We do not live in a perfect world and I think BL is as balanced as it could be.
I hope no one thinks my post was meant to bust anyones chops and cause hard feelings. Feel free to criticize my post because it is only my opinion.

The bottom line is that I believe that BL is an awesome fishery and it can not compare to any public access lake we have here in Northeast Pennsylvania. It may or may not be the fishery it was years ago but it is leaps and bounds better than any lake I have ever fished.

[Glenp]

I've been following this post with interest. I have fished the lake since 1995, first staying at a rental camp and for the past 4 years at our own property. During the past 15 years, I have observed various cycles on the lake. Without a doubt, the crappie fishing has declined in numbers, however we catch larger ones now. The smallmouth bass fishing has improved. The walleye fishing is better than 15 years ago. We don't catch as many perch as we used to catch. Pike fishing fluctuates year to year. The bluegill fishing has been outstanding the past several years. Within each of these cycles there are micro cycles. Differant techniques are needed to catch the same fish. Tactics and methods change.

Our problem occurs that we tend toward status quo. We use the same methods. We expect the same results year after year. When our expectations are not met, we panic.

Herein lies the danger - we react out of our panic and as a result, we attempt to interfere in the natural cycles. The answers to this issue of declining bass fishery are not found in reactions like tearing down the fish houses. Any healthy fishery must be harvested regularly or the population becomes stunted.

Incidentally, last Friday morning was by far the best smallmouth fishing I have ever experienced at BL. Saturday morning was a completely differant story.

I would caution against reactionary thinking about the bass fishing. That will only lead to actions that ultimately harm the fishery.

[sasnyder]

Maybe Glenp has a point. The fish seem to turn off & on so quickly.
I think it is the same regardless of where you fish. It just happens Black is fish heavily by so many people that say they are not catching as many. are the fish not there or have thier taste buds changed. I know here in the catskill watershed areas the fish wether it be bass ,trout ,perch,crappie or what ever they may bite like crazy for 2 to 5 days then you may not catch another thing for the rest of the season. one of the many joys of fishing.. I would also like to read camp owners opinion on this subject also, they are the ones cleaning the fish cleaning stations.
would also like to hear Ptrivilino opinion on the subject.

[Bassbuster]

I'm basing my opinion on 25 years of bass fishing in the lake. I target bass and I have been blessed to be able to fish the lake probably about 20+x year. I was a tournament fisherman and no all the tricks and know BL as good as anyone. Many of my friends still fish tournaments on the lake and I also know several people that also fish the lake almost as much as me just for fun. Everyone is observing the same thing, this is not an over reaction. I agree that the tear down all the fish houses was! It did get a rise from many folks! Go out and google search bass clubs in the area. They have archived tournament results some going. back to the 80s the data is there to support my claim I agree BL is still a good fishery I jjst want to see it come back to the greatness of days of old. There are many great fisheries in ny like oneida and many of the finger lakes. My friend just one a tournament in Honeoye Lake one of finger lakes with 21 some odd pounds and also won lunker with 6. some odd ounce lunker. This used to be about the weight and lunker that would win a tournament on black. not anymore the avg tournament is won in the 10-12 lb range and lunker 3lb range. Yeah quantity in. BL is good. but quality of fish just is not as good anymore. Great discussion let's keep it going I'm confident that something positive will eventually come our of this.
.sorry for spelling etc sent from my phone!

[Bassbuster]

Captain Yager was stopped by the DEC last week and I saw a patrol boat on Saturday so it sounds like they're paying more attention to BL. I know they picked the wrong guy to stop but at least they're out there from an enforcement standpoint! I also agree with the Captain and. Rich from BLA regarding water quality issues. I also believe septic tank issues are the cause of many of our issues. Does anyone know if there are any gov't agencies conduct mandatory dye testing in our area? I think some are fully aware of the problem their system maybe causing and just ignore it and there are even some who blantently discharge grey water directly into the water! Then I also believe there are many who just don't know anything about their system and would be shocked to see the dye show up in the water where their kids or neighbors are swimming!

[papreacher]

I have read the replys regarding the state of black lake. I see it where I live on the Juniata river if you keep it all it doesn't come back. I come here because I love the north and the fishing. My family and I do like fish but we keep bluegills and perch if we want to eat any. Encourage anyone coming here to keep panfish to eat, let the bass go and they will come back in time so don't lose hope.

[StrikeKing]

I've been reading these posts for weeks, and although I can't say that I was there 20 years ago, I can say that I've been coming to BL every year since 2003 and it is by far the best bass fishery in nys. I totally disagree with the comparison mentioned before that the fingerlakes are better...I can tell you that I lived on Cayuga Lake for 4 years and know that lake as well as anyone and it is NOT a premiere fishery UNLESS you are fishing for trout/salmon.
Bass are just like people when it comes to appetite. You have to finesse them, entice them, and you can't miss when you have the chance. If you do the same thing you have always done, you'll get the same results you've always gotten. If you're fishing with the same rubber worm for an hour and not catching any fish you're wasting your time. In the world of bass fishing persistance=stupidity. You have to be versatile, and constantly devoted to finding what works for that day! Once you know, hammer them...but be prepared to have to go through the same hoops the next day! Pay attention to the Barometric Pressure. It's so critical to bass fishing in shallow bodies of water (all thoughts of relativity aside, when you've lived on a finger lake that's 500 feet deep you realize what a shallow body of water is). I've studied barometric pressue to the point of exhaustion...and I have become 10x the fisherman for it. I've gotten so good, that there are days I won't even bother getting in the boat...and those are probably the days an inexperienced fisherman would think are ideal and head for the nearest shoreline laced with lilly pads.
So, my overall response to everyone claiming the lake isn't what it was is this: go out at night, mid week, regardless of weather. Fish from 8pm-5 am on the shores with surface baits. If your 5 fish limit of more than 20 pounds still leaves you thinking that the lake is only glimpse of what it was then I can only shake my head and wish that I had fished it back then...

[jerry d]

I'm not deneying that Black Lake isn't a good fishery.Tthe title of the thread is "BL isn't the fishery that it used to be"...........and it's not at least for me anyway.

I've talked to a fair number of people that been fishing the lake 30+ years and it went from a fantastic fishery to a good one.

Stop the slide and strongly advocate catch & release! From what I understand the crappie marathon is @ an all time low also.


I don't live on the lake & I only fish it 1 week a year nor am I pretending to be a marine biologist....but to me this just seems to be a case of over harvest.

I go to BL for one reason .....to fish. If the fishing gets too poor I wont go there,with St. Lawrence near by that would be my next destination.

[Bassbuster]

Well said Jerry d from LI , we appreciate your support!

[jack]

read the in put and would like to add my two cents. i've been going to bl for about 25 years and we've have our good years and bad. the weather has played a big part of the bad and good years. i think the size limit that was requested by the fish camps didn't help. if you kept it at 14" and left the limit at five. the limint would take care of the meat fishermen. i'm from new jersey and the lakes here have three or four times the fishing presser. so thats not it. the other thing is the fishing live wells, i seen a tip that if you add 1oz. of hydrogen peroxide solution, the one in your mecieine cabinet. it will add a lot of oxygen to the water and help to keep the fish live. i got that info. from the BASS DOCTOR. i've fished in about 15 states. but i keep coming back to black lake, to the point of buying a camp on the lake 5 years ago. most of the lake i fish have a shore line of 1 ft. to 5 or 6 ft. then going the deep water that being said. that makes black lake the bigs shore line of any lake i've fished. this year i was getting fish in the middle of the lake. (15ft.) i think fishing at bl is still very good. but don't let it get around. good luck jack

[jerry d]

Well said Jerry d from LI , we appreciate your support!

Thanks Bassbuster...........read the thread '"the future of black lake"

Guided bass trips & RochNY bring out some very good points.

While I still FIRMLY believe that catch & release would help the fishery to grow these gentlemen point out some some issues that make sense to me.

If there is any way that I can be of any help PLEASE feel free to ask.

[Mr._Whack_Master]

First off, I"m an out of state fisherman who will be fishing the waters of BL in early September.

I've been following this thread (along with several others) for a while now. Frankly, some of the posts here have appalled me. I really don't understand how anyone can complain about fishermen taking a legal quantity of fish from the lake. I do understand the disappointment that the lake may not be producing the way it did "in the good ol' days" but as long as the laws are followed, it is each fishermans right to decide how many legal fish he keeps, if any. Perhaps the laws need to be changed and there have been several good ideas about that to help increase the overall quality of fish. My point would be that there must be some middle ground on this issue. A little give and take so to speak.

[fishUC]

agree - never said nothing about legal limits - its the law.

In reference to BL being the best fishery in NYS - I would say oneida, st lawrence, champlain and cazenovia are MUCH better bass producing lakes than BL. Besides cazenovia, BL is the least popular for pleasure boaters and BL probably has the best fishing accomodations. But the fishing itself- BLK doesn't compare, size or quantity to oneida or cazenovia

[ICE ADDICT]

BL is the least popular for pleasure boaters and BL probably has the best fishing accomodations.


Works for me!!